Wednesday, December 05, 2012

The Last King of Edom

This is a short post, just plain and simple.  It comes at a time when the world is about to go to war to prevent Assad from using the sarin gas that he is assembling from its various components to use against the rebels and other enemies that I am sure are on his list.  He will not go down quietly.  Patriot missile batteries are being installed in Turkey by NATO ostensibly for defensive purposes, but perhaps it is felt that those batteries will be needed as NATO becomes more active in supporting the goals of the Syrian rebels.  This war has not blown up yet into a world war, but there are a lot of trigger happy people in tense moods right now.  I am sure that Netanyahu is one of them but so is Erdogan, Putin, Achmadinejad, and Abdullah.  It is hard to prove right now who will be the 2nd king who will fall when this finally blows up.  It is likely that when NATO goes full force in Syria, that Russia and Iran will coordinate an attack on Turkey from two separate fronts.  Then NATO will react to close the Bosporus to the Russian Navy fencing in the portion of their Navy in the Black Sea separating Russia from the portion of its Navy in the Mediterranean Sea with its port at Tartus, Syria.  How will the fenced in portion of the Russian Navy react to an attempt to blockade the Bosporus from Russian shipping?  Hmm.

Anyway, without talking about the Fiscal Cliff, I wanted to present a very basic proof directly from the Torah that Obama is the last leader of Edom and will likely oversee the sudden disappearance of Western Civilization over the next few monnths, but not more than three years.  From Parshat VaYishlach we learn that there were 8 kings of Edom before a king ruled over the Children of Israel.  Here is the verse introducing that fact:  I heard all this in the name of Rav Amnon Yitzchak:

Vaeilah Hamelachim Asher Malkhu B'Eretz Edom (And these are the kings that ruled in the Land of Edom...) before a king ruled over the Children of Yisrael.  Very direct reference in a clear verse in Genesis.  The Roshei HaTeivot (acronym) for the dependent clause is Vav, Hey, Aleph, Mem, Bet, Aleph.  Now every Hebrew newspaper in Israel spells Obama's name as follows:  Aleph, Vav, Bet, Aleph, Mem, Hey.  Notice that these are the exact same letters in the dependent clause of that verse,  The independent clause refers to Mashiach in and End of Days context as the king who will rule over the Children of Israel.  There are no clever tricks here.  Yes the letters are jumbled, but this is a verse in the Written Torah where every word was dictated by G-d Himself.  It is not in Navi (the Prophets) where the visions are from G-d, but the visions are described in the words of the various Prophets. So there it is: a clear reference to Obama in the Written Torah referring to the final king ruling over Edom who is half Muslim and half Xtian (That is from the Book of Daniel.)  Anyway something to think about.  Plus one last thing.  The 8th king in the list of kings named Hadar never died.  So this hints that Mashiach will come while Obama is still the last king.  Now, Rome (Edom) will surely lose most of its power in this 5th year of the Shmittah cycle.

But there is a body of work by Rav Chaim Vital that even after Edom collapses, the world will still have a galut called Galut Yishmael until ben David shows up in year 8, the year 5776.  So while Rome is destroyed in year 5, in 5773, we will still have to contend with Yishmael for three more years!!  Here is a link to Yeranen Ya'akov's blog which describes the Yishmaelic short exile:  here.   The final three years of the present Shmittah cycle will be dedicated to our return to Torah here in Eretz Yisrael.  Like all good things spiritual, it will likely take three years.  So Yishmael is the one who pushes us in that direction, not Edom.  The final three years will also involve Persia waxing to the status of a world power and seeking to take over the world.  This process is described in Medrash Sefer Eliyahu, describing in detail years four?, five, six, and seven of our present Shmittah (Sabbatical) cycle.  The actual first confrontation between Persia and the West was actually in the summer of 5772 when Persia started shooting off missiles at American dummy targets representing installations that are spread throughout the Persian Gulf.  Then Western minesweepers started sniffing for mines in the Strait of Hormuz during the summer.  So the three year buildup to a full fledged final war in year 7, has already begun.  Can these three years be short-circuited at the end of the nine months?  I am not sure, but it is doubtful since G-d desires our Free Will and our decision to return to Torah without being forced to do so.  G-d bless.


Anonymous Elisandra said...

I've been reading your blog for a very long time, and I really enjoy it, and I can follow your logic within the context you are using, but I've wanted to ask one question the entire time I've been reading.

I realize that referring to Edom as Rome and now somehow as the U.S. is the thing that is done. But I am curious how Edom, which was the land of Esau's descendants south of Israel/Judah, ever became Rome, Italy, and now the U.S. Did it all at some point just become metaphorical? Or are the Rabbis saying that somehow Esau's descendants all left the Middle East, moved to Italy, then later moved to the US?

Anyway . . . I've always just wondered that.

12/05/2012 4:20 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

How will the West and most of the world be able to blame all of this on Israel? You know they will and this is the concern because of the backlash and blame that will be foisted on every Jew living in galut.

12/05/2012 5:46 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Include Kim Jong-UN among the triggers, who is directly threatening Shirat Devorah with a missle, exiled in Aboriginal Australia.

12/05/2012 6:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It's about to hit the fan.

12/05/2012 7:18 AM  
Blogger Leah said...

Question: I have heard that the Arabs will rule for a short while before Moshiach. What in our day does this mean? Meaning they rule because of their unfortunate suicide bombers and we are ruled because we have no way of detecting them of stopping them and therefore live in fear? Or is the Yishmaelite exile the short rein that is talked about?

12/05/2012 7:23 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

That is about the West, Edom and Yishmael. But what about the powers of the Far East, i.e., China? And maybe even India?

12/05/2012 11:56 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

To Elisandra: Who is Edom. Please refer to

12/05/2012 12:02 PM  
Anonymous Meir M. said...

To Elisandra. Who is Edom? Please refer to

12/05/2012 12:04 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said... is a Xtian website. It should be pointed out that Yoshke was Esav incarnate or at the very least his best friend. As they say what a friend we have in Yoshke. Xtianity did come from Judaism but rejected two basic realities about how G-d judges the world and Men.

1. Our acts are not dirty rags. G-d knows that we have to choose between the lesser of two evils and the greater of two goods often. We rarely get to choose between black and lily white. Yitzchak Avinu lived in that world of black and white and always chose white. This is why he represents Din in the world which is the absolute choice between absolute good over evil. Neither of his two sons lived in that Gan Eden type existence in Eretz Yisrael, and neither do we. Yitzchak Avinu after the akeidah was a special case, and therefore there are very few stories about tests that he had after the Akeidah except for retreating from Gaza and digging new wells along the way. Even there we see that rather than confront and do business with evil, he just retreated to find his Gan Eden existence further north first in Esek then in Sitna then in Rehovoth. Ya'akov's approach was the fusion of Chessed and Din, to find the chessed in the Din. Ya'akov studied in his tent all day to understand the world of extenuating circumstances and how to apply Din in a case by case basis. This is real Emeth, the ability to apply Din while taking into account extenuating circumstances. For this reason alone all Mankind and of course all of us are accountable because G-d Himself takes into account our extenuating circumstances, and therefore judges us accordingly. Therefore the need for a Yoshke is both obsolete from the beginning of time and has always been unnecessary. He is also a stumbling block who prevents people from thinking through how to behave the best way that they can in a world where the moral choices are filled with varying shades of gray. Sorry, there are no excuses to simply give up like Esav himself did because he had no understanding of what Ya'akov was contemplating in his tent. This is part One.

12/05/2012 2:44 PM  
Blogger Marcia Fremont said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

12/05/2012 3:52 PM  
Blogger Marcia Fremont said...

Dov i have a specific question to what is happening in the north right now. I understand that Russia would be furious to have it's access to Syria cut off and blocked by NATO'S shutting down the Bosporus but since both Russia and Iran have big big trade relationships with Turkey, wouldn't they attack NATO or the West somehow? Why would they attack Turkey? because Turkey allowed the Patriots? (sorry i had to repost)

12/05/2012 3:57 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Turkey is a full fledged NATO partner. An attack against Turkey is an attack against NATO. and vice versa. An attack against NATO will cause Turkey to be involved in a NATO coalition.

12/05/2012 4:10 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

In short Turkey is no less a part of NATO than Germany, France, England, or the United States.

12/05/2012 4:11 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Enjoy the ride, Marcia. Or as the Vilna Gaon might tell you to do: At least wash your Shabbat clothes today. Who knows if you might need them tomorrow. For when the Russian Navy bursts in force through the Bosporus,.....

12/05/2012 4:16 PM  
Blogger Serious Bible Student said...

An Important point: The verse in Vaishlach states" these are the "KINGS" (plural- more than 1) If you look at the previous pusik (Lamed) the last two words start witb "Beis" and "Shin" ie, BUSH. So you have Bush, Obama and then a King who reigns over Bene Yisrael!!!

12/05/2012 4:19 PM  
Blogger Marcia Fremont said... this scenario the access to Syria would be more important than the trade relations with Turkey i guess ? Washing :)
btw..on another note...saw the US testing of the EMP... preparing for 5775?

12/05/2012 4:33 PM  
Blogger Neshama said...

I asked my husband the same question that Alisandra asked you. It would be interesting to know the migrations of Eisav away from Edom/EY to Europe. The transition to America is an easy one; immigration from England/Ireland etc, the early settlers and founding fathers of the 'New Land' actually founded with Jewish principles.

12/05/2012 5:38 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

I will be picking up Me'Am Loez on sefer Shmot tomorrow which has a fascinating story of the migration of Tzefo the son of Eliphaz the son of Esav to Phoenicia and then on to Carthage. I will have to get back to you on the origin of Esav on the Italian Peninsula at the time that Yosef was still alive in Mitzraim. more about that when I get the sefer.

I happen to know for sure that at the time that Shlomo took on a Mitzri wife, Gavriel HaMalach took a reed and stuck it in the Mediterranean Sea where Har vESUVius is, and the volcanic uplift of Mt. Esav brought much of the entire Western Coast of Italy out of the Sea, and on the day that the Kingdom of Shlomo split it two during the reign of Rechavam, the City of Rome was founded.

Let me check Me'am Loez. I believe that this medrash is also brought down in Shmot Rabba. more later. thanks

12/05/2012 9:54 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Rome foundation myth is of twins Romulus and Remus who were raised by a wolf. Romulus kills Remus at some point.
Sounds like how Eisav would tell the story of what happened to Yaacov.

12/05/2012 10:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rashi says at the end of Parshas Vayishlach that Edom is Esav.

Rashi last line of Parsha Vayishlach Magdiel: This is Rome. — [From Pirkei d’Rabbi Eliezer, ch. 38]

12/06/2012 2:27 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Throughout time, many people have laid out apocalyptic scenarios. Every one of them has been wrong, and this one too will prove to be untrue.

12/06/2012 3:09 AM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

There is no apocalypse here. That would mean the end of the world or its total destruction. Look at it as the rebirth of something much better as the old world of lies ends up in ruin. The World of Truth is about to be born. And the world of lies will lie in ruin. It is almost Messianic!! Well it is Messianic, and that will be worth a tremendous celebration when the baby is born! At this juncture it is unclear whether it will be Mashiach ben Ephraim or ben David at the end of these nine months. And if it is ben Ephraim, then we will have about three years to do a full teshuvah before ben David comes in year number 8. One or the other, it will be much better than the world of lies that so many apparently love, but it will be destroyed along with those who love it.

12/06/2012 3:35 AM  
Blogger Jesterhead45 said...

I readily concede that the following is likely to be wrong though what about this scenario as to how Edom became Rome.

While the Roman founding myth involves the slaying of one brother at the hands of another,
there is also the possibility that Xianity was actually founded by Hellenized/Romanized Jews of Edomite origin that were forcibly converted during the Hasmonean era.

12/06/2012 4:07 AM  
Anonymous Elisandra said...

But honestly, how can everyone in the U.S. and Europe all be descendants of Esau? There were a lot of other people around at the time. And the Bible says that the isles of the gentiles came from Noah's son Japheth, not Shem, so there should be a large portion of the gentile world that don't have any semitic ancestry at all. It makes more sense if it's metaphorical. Then anyone who hates Jacob, but isn't Ishmael, would be called Edom.

But most Americans don't hate Israel. Sadly, there's a very loud contingent these days of anti-American Americans who know nothing about history, hate the religions they were raised in, hate their country, and root for whoever and whatever is the "other", even if the "other" would rush to kill them first chance they got.

But what of the nice pro-Israel Americans over here? I would not be happy to have to suffer the same fate as those rooting for Hamas.

12/06/2012 5:14 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As Dov points out, Me'am Loez has the medrash stated where Tzefo goes to Carthage and them to Kittim (which most will say is Cyprus). They spread out to Italy and intermingle with the Etruscans (b'nei yefet), so Esau's mixed spiritual progeny ultimately ends up on the Italian peninsula.

12/06/2012 7:41 AM  
Blogger Leah said...

Dov- Bar- LEib will you answer my question about where it says the arabs will rule for a short time? I posted it above. Thank you.

12/06/2012 5:26 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

There is a hot link in the last paragraph of this post marked: here.

That is the link to Yeranen Ya'akov's blog which talks about Galut Yishmael and quotes an extensive essay by Rav Chaim Vital, the student of the Ariz"l, on this subject of Galut Yishmael. It does not mean that the Arabs will rule here in Eretz Yisrael, but it indicates that while Mashiach ben Ephraim is ruling here in E.Y., Yishmael will gather strength over the rest of the world, a process that is already in motion. It also allows Persia to become a world power in the Shmittah year, 5775.

I promise you the link is there, but just in case you cannot find it, here it is again:

You can believe this: Galut Yishmael, if it is necessary, will be far worse outside of Eretz Yishmael than inside EY. And that is a big if. It may not be necessary, or the three year period might be shortened. And it is also key to understanding that while Galut Yishmael might be necessary over the rest of the world, Mashiach ben Ephraim will already be ruling here in E.Y. Once the West falls, Mashiach ben Ephraim rises or is already here. But ben Ephraim's malkhut is not over the entire world, only here in E.Y. if an extra three year period is necessary.

12/06/2012 5:40 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

I also commented myself twice on that Yeranen Ya'akov post. My comments fit in with Sefer Medrash Eliyahu's description of the last three or four years of galut. and the three years ends with the victory over Persia by the son of a slavewoman or maidservant named Gigit or Gigi in 5775.

12/06/2012 5:45 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

I realize that my hot link to Medrash Sefer Eliyahu is no longer working. The website which was there a few years ago has removed the translation of the medrash, and it was a wonderful translation. I am sad about that. It would be easy to refer to that translation, and I have a hard copy of it anyway. So I will blog about the three years of Persian buildup into a world power if it becomes more obvious that that is what is precisely occurring after Pesach 5773. Until Pesach Sheini, we will follow the Fall of Edom and other events that happen while they are happening. Devash posted that there is an eerie resemblance between Assad and Antiochus Epiphanes. Assad is a very secular Arab, a Ba'athist who prides himself in being secular. He is clean shaven like a Hellenist too even if he has a mustache like Yemach Shmo from WW2. And Antiochus was a "Syrian Greek". So we will have a better idea next week if something happens with him during Chanukah.

The Tzepho material in Me'am Loez is vast and way too much to cover in the comments section of this blog. I might try and write a post how Tzepho ben Eliphaz ben Esav ended up in Italy when there is a spare moment to breathe.

12/06/2012 6:08 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Oh, while reading about the travels of Tzepho ben Eliphaz, I came across a fascinating etymology of the ancient Phoenician city of Carthage which I believe was in what is now Tunisia. The Phoenicians were a merchant civilization that traded throughout the Mediterranean. So they actually established a "planned" city on the North African Coast as a halfway point between Lebanon and Spain and lower England (in ancient times this was Tarshish) and called the city Kiryatah Chadasha (New City). They shortened the name to Kiryatach or Karthage. Nice, right??

12/06/2012 6:23 PM  
Anonymous Noahide in Alabama said...

Dov Bar-Leib, The "Wayback Machine" captured and saved a copy of the Sefer Eliyahu (english translation) before it was removed from the other website. To read it online, copy and paste the following link:

Or use this short version of the link:

12/06/2012 10:27 PM  
Blogger Marcia Fremont said...

Dov, 2 things. 1) The Galut mentioned it would allow Persia to become a world power by 5775, but i am confused as Persia is Persia..not Yishmael. Or am I misunderstanding.
2)A friend says the almond tree at the entrance to her moshav (Even Sapir) has been in bloom (slow bloom) since two weeks ago...she has taken pictures. They are calling it Shkedia Chanuka.. What do you think it means> Does it seem significant knowing what it says in Yirmeyahu and what's happening?

12/06/2012 10:43 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Medrash Sefer Eliyahu has been fixed in the sidebar!!!

Thank you to A. K. for his timely help in finding the link at a slightly different web address.

12/06/2012 10:57 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

First of all thank you Noahide from Alabama. Secondly, there are 35 spiritual nations under the influence of Edom in the world, and there are 35 spiritual nations underneath the influence of Yishmael in the world. This is according to the Vilna Gaon explaining why during the listing of the days for the sacrifices during Musaph of Sukkot, 35 of the bulls are offered up on days 1, 2, and 4 when the Torah says Se'ir Izzim (male goat of the goats). These are the days of Sukkot when the nations of Yishmael are judged. And on days 3, 5, 6, 7 another 35 bulls total are offered and the Torah only says Se'ir (male goat). These refer to the 35 nations of Edom. The principle nation from Edom is Amalek. In our modern world there are over 2 billion Xtians and I am not sure how many of them are or were at one time Xtian countries. There are also 1.4 billion Muslims now in about 52 or 53 Muslim countries. The Hindu and Buddhist countries are included amongst the Bnai Keturah and I believe we count them in with the 35 nations of Yishmael especially if you accept Rashi that Hagar and Keturah were one and the same. If there had not been a mess up in the lack of our human decency in 5765, the years of Sukkot according to the Cosmic Clock were supposed to be from 5765 until 5771. 5772, the year of Shmini Atzereth was supposed to be the grand finale. The South Asian Tsunami, remember that one, struck on the 14th of Tevet 5765 and basically struck Hindu and Muslim nations in the world. It was the first year of Sukkot when the bnai Hagar/ Keturah were supposed to be judged. So it was already decreed on Rosh Chodesh Tevet 5765 that the final Redemption would begin, but something so indecent and so evil took place on the 9th of Tevet 5765, that the Geulah was stopped in its tracks and sent spinning into our Shmittah cycle almost 8 years later. The Erev Ze'ir colluded with the Erev Rav to enable Sharon's government on that very day. Yet the South Asian Tsunami had already been decreed on Rosh Chodesh Tevet. So it was allowed to occur. But do not expect the order of the sacrifices of Sukkot to continue in this Shmittah cycle. As a matter of fact, because of the evil of the Erev Rav, Edom is being destroyed first. The 35 nations of Yishmael will be destroyed later, hopefully less than three years later. And Amalek exists in Yishmael too. Yet, Amalek is far more prevalent in the more radical Shiite version of Islam than the Sunni version. And the principal Shiite nation in the world is Persia. Does that help??

12/06/2012 11:47 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

I should also say that Yishmael as an entity can be divorced from the Amalek within its midst. And Chazal tell us that Yishmael (that is the pure Yishmael that is spiritually green in the nefesh elyon) will repent at the End of Days once it is divorced from Amalek.

12/06/2012 11:52 PM  
Blogger Marcia Fremont said...

Thanks, yes that was good explanation. Actually your last sentence "And Chazal tell us that Yishmael (that is the pure Yishmael that is spiritually green in the nefesh elyon) will repent at the End of Days once it is divorced from Amalek." is how i have for a long time looked at pure Yishmael. I have felt that both xtian and muslim nations were a part of Esau/Edom and that the judgement against Edom would include muslim nations also. So how you explained it makes much sense to me and is very helpful.

12/07/2012 12:03 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes, Dov has explained the Yishmael and Esav/Edom connections very well in these last few comments. But to clarify, those under Yishmael and those under Eisav/Edom are the 'spiritual' representations of Yishmael & Eisav. As the ancient peoples of Yishmael,Romans,Canaanites, etc. no longer exist but have integrated within the world populations, so those under the Xtian banner are Eisav/Edom and those under Yishmael (even if there is no geneological connections (such as Malaysians, etc.), but they are part of the moselm world) are the spiritual reps. of the Yishmaelim. These end time wars are really of a religious nature because it is leading us into the ultimate final redemption (the reason for creation) where the whole world will know that there is only Hashem, Ein Od Milvado.

12/07/2012 12:35 AM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

I should also note something else. The flags of a country more often than anything else represent the spiritual essence of that country. For the nations primarily under Edom's influence: (Red= Edom or Amalek. Pure Gaivah (pride) in the nefesh elyon (upper or divine soul) Red gaivah is incompatible with any service to G-d. And therefore Amalek must be eliminated from the world before the Shekhinah will return to Tzion. They have throughout history tried to do it to us, but we will have to do it to them (Amalek). Green= The Children of Yafeth who follow them. Whose taivahs or lower soul follow after their eyes (after beauty therefore the name Yafeth), Blue= the Judeo aspects of the country. The more blue, the better the country or the friendlier it is to Jews. White= This is confusing because it can represent purity or Lavan's influence in that country. If the country is in the latter stages of spiritual collapse it represents the deceitful Lavan.

In the nations under Yishmael's influence, the colors represent something quite different. Red: Amongst the Sunni and Bnai Keturah nations, red represents the taivahs of the heart in the lower (animal) soul, and therefore represent the spirit of Ham in that country. The spirit of Ham can be integrated into the Messianic Era as long as those taivahs are properly directed. Amongst the Shiite Muslim countries Red is dangerous and is always Amalek and will therefore be wiped out whether it be in Persia or in Shiite parts of Lebanon. Green is the collective pride of Islam (in the upper or Divine soul) amongst the nations of Yishmael. In Yemot HaMashiach, it is that aspect of Yishmael that will do teshuvah since the pride is collective and not individual, it can be forced to bend to G-d's ultimate will. And since Truth will be popular in the Messianic Era, the lie of the spiritual eyes will be removed from the world so that spiritual green will not prevent the Shekhinah from returning to Tzion like spiritual red will. Blue in the Muslim world is the Children of Shem whose animal soul (lower soul) follows their Divine soul (which for Yishmael is green.)

So Ya'akov is both blue in the animal soul because he is from Shem, and he is blue in the Divine soul.

Summary: Red is to follow after one's heart: For the animal soul that would be lusts and desires as with the Children of Ham. For the Divine soul that would be personal pride as with Edom.

Green is to follow after one's eyes: For the animal soul it is the search for beauty as with the Children of Yafeth. In the Divine soul, this is Islam, the religion of popular pride on the collective scale.

Blue is to transcend both the heart and the eyes to connect to G-d. Blue in the animal soul connects to to the authority of the Divine soul. And Blue in the upper or Divine soul is to connect to G-d. And you will look upon the thread of Techeilet (sky blue wool)... and you will not stray after your heart (lusts and personal pride) or after your eyes (beauty and popularity). There is no other way to bring peace to the world.

12/07/2012 12:57 AM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

The flag of Turkey is most disturbing, for it is all red. It is a Muslim nation with a Xtian heritage centuries ago. So even though the Sunni branch of Islam is predominant in Turkey, Togarmah is from the Children of Yafeth not Ham. So the red in the flag cannot be Ham. It is the spirit of Amalek even though Turkey is a Sunni country. I believe that this explains both the Armenian genocide from 100 years ago and Erdogan today. Maybe he is....

12/07/2012 1:17 AM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Now if Devash is right and Assad turns out to be Antiochus Epiphanes, then well here is the hint. It comes from the old song: Istanbul is Constantinople....So if Assad is Antiochus, then Erdogan is ..... and the 2nd king to fall.

12/07/2012 3:06 AM  
Anonymous Alex said...

Hi Dov. I found something interesting. You said the Tsunami was already decreed on Rosh Chodesh Tevet 5765 that the final Redemption would begin, but something so indecent and so evil took place on the 9th of Tevet 5765, that the Geulah was stopped in its tracks and sent spinning into our Shmittah cycle almost 8 years later. Now look at this 5765 was the 4th year of the shmittah cycle. Now if we go to the present cycle which started 5769 and fast-forward to the 4th year Rosh Hodesh Tevet 5773 is December 14 2012 (this date should be significant up in Heaven). The ninth of Tevet is December 22, 2012 the same date as the Mayan Calendar and the same day that the Geulah was stopped because of the disengagement from Gaza in the previous cycle, what do you think of this? If my calculations are wrong please let me know.

12/07/2012 8:57 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

9th of Tevet 5765, that is the day we left our great hip trendy home two blocks from schule in the US forever to make aliayh.

I had finally convinced my wife earlier that year that we had to come after a lefty-center Israeli at schule perhaps rightly said that as chutznikim we had no vote and our opinion was nothing to close his discussion of the planned gerusha of Aza.

12/07/2012 9:34 AM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Of course, it is significant. Yet notice that in 5765, we were in year 4 of the Shmittah cycle. In this Shmittah cycle we are in year 5 already. We are in the Shmittah cycle of Geulah by necessity, not Geulah by choice. Apparently in the Gog ben Gog of Eretz Magog Shmittah cycle we had a collective choice to simply be decent, but we "collectively" failed that choice on the 9th of Tevet in year 4 of that Shmittah cycle. In this cycle there are no collective tests, just tests on those who messed up in the previous Shmittah cycle. There are individual tests to be sure, but collectively the only group with free will to change how quickly this process proceeds is the Erev Ze'ir. (The Erev Rav is too far gone spiritually to have any free will whatsoever. If one voted for Obama as a group, he is already in the spiritual toilet. Individually as always, one can get out of that state but not the group called the Erev Rav.) If they give up their gashmiyut and basements in the lands of their dispersion, the Geulah can come more quickly in Chu"l. If they do not, G-d will arrange it this year that certain aspects of Geulah will occur this year in Eretz Yisrael while these things will not be felt in Chu"l. This is part of the essence of Mashiach ben Ephraim who comes before returning to the Torah in order to return us to the sanity of common decency. But he only rules "b'kerev haAretz" not in Chutz LaAretz like his father Yosef did. And during this time Galut Yishmael will rule throughout the rest of the entire world. The other possibility, if Jews in Chu"l choose it, is to correct the error of desiring to remain there in the desert with the gashmiyut and their basements before G-d takes that all away. Once they lose that free will choice to leave of their own volition, they will either come here with pajamas in a plastic bag or (I csn't speak it.) In addition there might be other ways to prevent the necessity of Galut Yishmael in Chutz LaAretz, but it will be difficult to pass those collective tests.

Here is a dream of a Tzaddik in Boro Park in Chu"l discussing this 2nd possibility (other than Aliyah):

Yet, it will be difficult to collectively pass a test where for instance, everyone decides to stop talking during davening. And notice that this teshuva applies to Chu"l and was told to a tzaddik in Chu"l. Even though as individuals we should not talk in Shul in E.Y. either, it is not a test for our redemption here in E.Y. now that we have reached year 5 of this final cycle.

Please remember that Mashiach ben Ephraim can prevent Yishmael from engulfing us here in E.Y., but he cannot destroy Yishmael since Ephraim's ko'ach in the world is only over Edom. And only Ben David's kingdom will be a kingdom for the entire world. As it says for Yehudah, when Shilo comes, etc.

Happy Chanukah, and G-d bless.

12/07/2012 9:53 AM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

I should quickly point out that it is Mashiach ben David who helps us return to the Torah, not Mashiach ben Ephraim who helps establish us in decency, the Yesod of the Torah.

12/07/2012 10:01 AM  
Blogger Neshama said...

Happy Chanukah too!
I remember your post about the Gigit etc., but his name (not the country) escapes me :-)

12/07/2012 10:44 AM  
Blogger Neshama said...

Forgot this.
I have Meam Loez, Shemot, which volume is it?

12/07/2012 10:45 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And now R' Berel Wine shlita weighs in:

12/07/2012 1:29 PM  
Anonymous Elisandra said...

What happened in Tevet 5765. The Gaza expulsion started on Tisha b'Av, so what is the Tevet event?

12/07/2012 5:48 PM  
Blogger Neshama said...

I found it and read it on Shabbat, the portion of Shemot, in Sefer Shemot of Meam Loez, very near the beginning. It also speaks of his relatives that still lived in Edom, when he asked for heir help in a battle. I forgot how inclusive and interesting the Meam Loez is. I will try IY"H to read this each week.

12/08/2012 6:14 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

Early in December of 2004 before Chanukah, Tommy Lapid took his 15 "I hate G-d" or Shinui seats out of Sharon's coalition. The two reshayim had a spat, and both of them really hated each other so that there was no way that they were going to mend fences for re-unification. Sharon's Disengagement Plan had already been approved by the powers at be earlier that Fall even with about 13 Likud rebels in his party voting NO because they wanted to abide by the Likud referendum in May which had decidedly trounced the entire idea by over 60%. Yet, with Lapid gone, it was virtually impossible to avoid new elections before the planned Disengagement. Then Sharon made the startling announcement that without either UTJ (United Torah Judaism), the Ashkenazi Chareidi Party, or Shas, the Sephardi Chareidi Party, to help him shore up his government, the country was going to new elections to clear the air. Now, Shas's Gadol, Rav Ovadia Yosef, had already done his homework and declared that his party not under any circumstances whatsoever was ever going to join a unilateral Disengagement government. All Peace Treaties had to be negotiated, and even the Oslo one had been an abysmal failure. So it was a kal veChomer that Shas was not going to enable any stupid process just so that the world would love us for about one week. We were all hoping for a similar statement from Eliyashiv. Rav Ovadia Yosef had conferred with bunches of people before making his decision including top military brass and saw that the Disengagement was a horrible idea. Rav Eliyashiv had only talked to his party heads of UTJ like Moshe Gafni. There were not even discussions with Rav Mordechai Eliyahu or Rav Avraham Shapira to get the National religious to support his melamdim and avreichim financially for three months until the elections had taken place, and no one would have held anyone accountable for joining any new government after the elections. On the 9th of Tevet, 5765 (December 21st) it was just before the fast. I was downstairs that evening at the local Seret Vizhnitz shul in Tel Tzion. After a learning seder, I saw the recent HaModia on the table of the shul where the talmidim had been learning before Ma'ariv. And I read in horror that that very afternoon, on the 9th of Tevet, UTJ had sent a letter of intent to join Sharon's government and therefore enable the unilateral Disengagement Plan. My heart sunk right through the floor. And it was right to do so. All the keilim for Geulah in the Gog from Magog Shmittah Cycle were shattered. I did not know it at the time. But it became clearer by 2007 that Gog had no intention of dividing Jerusalem on his watch because he had received accusations that he was Gog after the Disengagement from Gaza in August 2005. So he quickly changed course and went out of his way to prove to G-d that he had no intentions of dividing Jerusalem while he was President.

12/08/2012 11:30 PM  
Blogger Dov Bar-Leib said...

In 2003 when Tommy Lapid received his 15 seats, Ariel Sharon had more than doubled Amram Mitzna's total (40 to 18) when Sharon ran on a platform of NO unilateral Disengagements. He had won in a landslide. There was no reason to believe that the Israeli public's opinion on the matter would have been different if there had been early elections if Sharon's government had simply fallen apart in December of 2004. Either way, there was another way for UTJ to raise the money for the hungry avreichim and melamdim that they were seeking to support. The national religious were more than willing to support them for three or four months just so there would have been new elections before any silly Disengagement plan went into effect. Large sums of money have been expended in Tzedakah anyway to help the families thrown out of their homes and families bombarded with missiles within the radius of Hamas rockets over the last 7 years. It would have been easier and just as fulfilling to support avreichim and melamdim learning Torah in Bnai Brak in order to avert this national tragedy of epic proportions. Yet, on the 9th of Tevet with that letter of intent from UTJ without even consulting Rav Eliyahu or Rav Shapira, the keilim were broken, and now 8 years later G-d is working with totally different keilim to bring the redemption.

12/08/2012 11:30 PM  
Blogger Leah said...

Dov Bar-Leib,
Shavua tov and Chanukah Sameach! Thank you and the other person who commented on the http. address for my question. I went and read the link. Both scary and yet amazing at the same time.
We live in times that are truly amazing and troubling.
It is also a blessing to be at this time and place.

12/09/2012 6:32 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Reb Dov
As we are to be an ohr lamim maybe pointing out and warning the son of gigi/gigit is what is needed rather than holding the secret. We saw that Gog W did a measure of teshuva though that was only after our own epic failure.
The other side is the logic of Yonah, he knew that the teshuva of Ninveh would give them the zechut needed to defeat the northern kingdom and schlep them off to a galus that is still in force.
Assuming that this person even does teshuva.

12/11/2012 9:24 AM  
Blogger Moriah said...

Obama's nominee for head of CIA is a Muslim convert who calls Israel Palestine and Jerusalem Al Quds...

2/10/2013 10:21 PM  
Blogger Klishlishi said...

Read R.David Katz's idea about a "Chinese Golus"

4/09/2013 5:36 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It's certain that the chinese and the people of the east, mostly descent from the children of keturah (who of course mixed with the pervious natives) who were sent to the far east.

The (european) christians descent from the edomites (aryan invaders) who mixed with the children of Japheth (pre - aryans).

North african and asian Muslims are mostly Ishmaelites (mixed again) regardless of the language they speak.

8/23/2013 12:57 PM  

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